|
This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Power Level article.
| ||
|---|---|---|
|
|
|
Power level and scaling to attributes[]
Power level can't be used to scale everything accurately.
Raising the power level increases power, because ki fortifies the body and increases durability, directly creates energy attacks, and increases flying speed resulting in much harder strikes. It also increases raw strength to some degree. Obviously this all means: higher power level = more advantage
It can be seen from character feats, however, that many of the attributes are not directly proportional. The power level gap of hundreds of thousands between Goku as a Kid and Goku as an adult in the Freeza saga did not give him hundreds of thousands of times the muscular strength, not did it make him hundreds of thousands of times faster. In the Super Exciting Guide, it states muscular training as a separate kind of training from ki training. Vegeta concentrated on it heavily, since he trained in gravities that would make his body weigh more than 27 tonnes. Ki still has a strong effect though, and the Super Saiyajin transformations appear to increase physical strength by more than 5 times (based on Goku's weight training in the afterlife) in proportion to increasing ki by more than 50 times according to the Daizenshuu.
Flying is affected because ki is what causes them to fly, and this is what causes them to hit so much harder with a higher power level. This is much more linear to the power level, but still not quite. When Gotenks tested his speed with more than one million mph to lap the world a couple of dozen times in under half an hour, his power level was much higher in proportion to lower people than his speed.
Durability is also not quite linear, since Vegeta's Final Flash was able to destroy Cell who had a higher power level and could have created bigger attacks himself. His ki couldn't protect him against a super planet busting beam. He was also destroyed by a max power Kamehameha against Goku, though in both instances he regenerated.
Power level could directly be used to scale ki attacks, and that's truely linear. Super Saiyajin Goku can create a max power attack with 50 times the yield of base Goku. Dragon Ninja talk
Periods and Comma's[]
I don't know who changed it because the original page was comma's but don't change the comma to represent thousands into periods, Ratiz's power level wasn't 1.2 it was 1200 but to noobs it might be confusing if written that way. —This unsigned comment was made by Lucasthalefty (talk • contribs) on 23:35, 30 July 2007.
ITS OVER 9000![]
ITS OVER NINE THOUSAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD!
WHAT 9000?!?!
- Should put a note about this meme in the page as a trivia?
- Funny thing... Goku's powerlevel in the Saiyan saga was misstranslated, and in the original japanese magna, IT WAS OVER 8000!!!.... (which better explains why Vegita was leagues above goku in the fight)
Possible Influence (for Toriyama)[]
Before even the original Dragonball, much less volume 17 where power levels are introduced, was Kinnikuman (known as M.U.S.C.L.E. and Ultimate Muscle in most other countries). That series also had power levels, called Choujin Kyoudo. These numbers were effectively base levels of power and rarely, if ever, factored into whether a person could actually beat an opponent. Kinnikuman himself sported a base power of 950,000, yet he constantly beat people with a power of over 100,000,000! One character who relied a lot on power levels, though, was Buffaloman. He was the one character who could lower and raise his power from 0 to 10,000,000 (a trait Toriyama would use). At level 0, he could move so fast that he would become invisible (another Toriyama trademark). My entire point here is that it's possible that Toriyama was influenced on the whole power level thing from Kinnikuman. -Krendall 21:43, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
Why can't we edit it[]
Why has this page been blocked from editing. I've got some stuff! Like, in the Saiyan Saga, Gohan's power level is 981, right? Using the calculation from his base power, you can get his Oozaru power level by timing it by 10. Vegeta says a Saiyan's power increases tenfold when he transforms into an Oozaru. So, Gohan's Oozaru power level would be 9,810. The Kaio-ken That Splits The Heavens 17:14, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
Dekoshu 14:26, 18 October 2008 (UTC) Maybe even bleach has a power level too.
- It was protected because of an edit war that was going on. I believe that the subject of the edit war is no longer pertinent to this article (because of the new article, List of Power Levels), so I have unblocked it. Hopefully this won't cause a problem. :-P --
talk contr 21:14, 18 October 2008 (UTC)
Dekoshu 21:17, 18 October 2008 (UTC) I hope so too.
Goku and Frieza's power levels...[]
Frieza's max is 12,000,000 and not 120,000,000. Same goes for Goku, his Super Saiyan power level was 15,000,000 and not 150,000,000. 05:55, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
- Could you please cite a source for this? We have one now, but we're welcome to suggestions. --
.10X.Ka.me.ha.me.ha.....talk.....contrib. 07:34, January 24, 2010 (UTC) - Frieza is 120.000.000 and Goku is 150.000.000 like it has been written and it's taken from more than one source. 12.000.000 is the 10% of Frieza's power... That 12.000.000 was just a mistranslation from the Japanese number...
- goldsaint13 18:03, June 29, 2011 (UTC)
Power Conversion[]
Do you know how many Watts are to a Ki?99.237.222.73 03:13, June 29, 2010 (UTC)
- Do you mean the Killiwatts that Babidi's speaks of? If so, there are no accurate way to convert them, since there are no recorded power levels after the trunks saga and Killiwatts comes into play at the Majin Buu saga SSJ4 Lewich talk contribs 11:19, June 29, 2010 (UTC)
- It has been confirmed in a Jump number that 1 Kili = 1.000.000 in terms of power levels... Super Saiyan Goku was 3.000 Kili and is stated as power level 3.000.000.000.
- goldsaint13 18:06, June 29, 2011 (UTC)
A Good Resource For Battle Power Questions[]
Check out the following site for a thorough discussion of battle powers / power levels--it should help with detailed questions: http://www.kanzentai.com/bp.php. Hope that helps! - Temp Templarion Prime 10:35, July 11, 2010 (UTC)
Goku's power level[]
I did some math, and calculated power levels in newtons. Because the farmer with his rifle had a power level of five, while a bullet has 2301 newtons, I calculated Goku's power level, 150,000,000 as 345,150,000,000 newtons. Basically, that means that if the nuclear bomb dropped on Hiroshima had a force of 300,000 newtons, then Goku's power level would be the equivalent of 1,150,500 nuclear bombs. With that kind of force, one Kamehameha should obliterate the planet before it's tossed. The heat emanating from the Kamehameha would have instantly turned the planet into a ball of plasma in a split second after it's creation. In that fight, Namek would have exploded, Frieza would have died quickly, and Goku would probably be raised back from the dead... again.
Hughdo 19:52, November 20, 2010 (UTC)
DBZ doesnt have newtons it is a fictional universe deal with it User:Ultimatesupersaiyanvegito/sig14 19:54, November 20, 2010 (UTC)
- Oh man, that is really interesting! Hehe, it's fun to apply some real-world statistics and calculations to a fictional one every once in a while for some perspective. It's certainly a fun note. Woah, USSV, I do believe it was in fun and an exercise in mathematics rather than actually trying to make the fictional universe real.
19:56, November 20, 2010 (UTC) - well i wasn't trying to be rude or anything just saying its a fictional universe User:Ultimatesupersaiyanvegito/sig14 19:57, November 20, 2010 (UTC)
Hehe, funny. But I think the farmer's power level is without his gun. Jeangabin666 20:20, November 20, 2010 (UTC)
New official power levels from Jump[]
Finally some new official power levels have been confirmed...
They are based on the facts that SSj3 is SSj2 x4 and SSj2 is SSj1 x2... And Toriyama also revealed that 1 Kili is 1.000.000 in power level and thus SSj FP Goku is 3.000.000.000 and Yakon is 800.000.000... Also Cell is stated as 4.000.000.000 and that is related to Darbula saying that 4.000 Kili is not enough to overcome him, because he is 4.000.000.000 in power level like Cell.
It also finally confirms that Gotenks is stronger than Goku, because SSj3 Goku is 24.000.000.000 and SSj3 Gotenks is 32.000.000.000 (he is 4.000.000.000 as SSj1 x8 = 32.000.000.000).
Here's the scan:
- That scan can't be real. You can't just throw a bunch of random power levels not even organized by Sagas on one list and call it proof. They are missing tons of characters. LSSJ4 18:45, June 29, 2011 (UTC)
- ----------It's not hard to guess the saga since the portaraits are easily recognizable in the chapters. Who cares if they are missing characters? We can't claim to have all the levels to add them... We should be happy to have at least them now... Any official level is official, end of the argument. We can call them mistaking as we can do with those given in the manga during Frieza saga, but this won't change them. And they are not simply guessed... They are related to the SSj multipliers and to the fact that 1 Kili is 1.000.000... Goku reached his limit as a SSj FP during Cell saga, as he said to Vegeta... "You can return into the Room of Spirit and Time because you can still get stronger, while I can't!" Infact Buu saga Goku is the same as Cell saga Goku as SSj1... His huge power boost comes all from SSj2 and SSj3...
- goldsaint13 11:08, June 30, 2011 (UTC)
Why does Vegeta drop from 24,000 to 10,000 when he turns Great Ape? 10X Kamehameha (talk) 02:19, June 30, 2011 (UTC)
That's not Vegeta... That's Gohan during Saiyan saga. That Vegeta would be 240.000 ad a Great Ape... Gohan instead was around 1000 during Saiyan saga, beside when he gets angered and has a level of 2800...
goldsaint13 11:08, June 30, 2011 (UTC)
Posted by Michael: That V-Jump scan is a fake. Take a look here: http://www.kanzentai.com/bp.php?id=fake
SuperKid55 12:00, June 24, 2012 (UTC)
What is super Vegetas power level next to super saiyan Gohan and super saiyan Gotenks. its 1,?00,000,000 what's the missing number. It has to be 2 0 8 or 9
Gotenks is not stronger than Goku. Haven't you noticed that neither Goten nor Trunks can transform into a SSJ3 individually? The power of the Fusion Dance itself allowed Gotenks to transform, so multiplying by eight to Gotenks power level would not apply if neither of the fusees could transform into SSJ3. UnknownUser99.29.18.249 03:28, May 14, 2013 (UTC)
-My only arguement about a fusion form being stronger than a regular form is a few simple facts, and a theory. Fact 1: SSJ3 Goku was ABOUT on par with, if not a little stronger than Majin Buu in the anime... Fact 2: SSJ3 Gotenks was almost exactly equal to the lesser super buu. But to contradict that, in the movie 'Wrath of the Dragon', Gotenks is shown possibly weaker than Goku... Another theory I have is, When calculating power levels (and the best example is the movie 'Fusion Reborn') going SSJ 1 isnt a ability that pulls power out of nowhere, it is a transformation that boosts your exsisting power. So each transformation is a several times boost more than the one below it. SSJ 3 Goku was apparently far weaker than Jenamba... As was Goku and Vegita fighting together agaisnt him. If you add vegitas and Gokus power together, even if both in SSJ 1 and SSj 2, its still weaker, or about the same as Goku SSJ 3. So my theory on the fusion is that it not adds the power of two saiyans together, but instead multiplies them into one much more powerful warrior... which explains why two tiny kids could match up to a massive pink blob, and why SSJ 1 Gogeta was many times stronger than Jenamba. I don't have any sources besides the anime itself... so my theory of the fusion isnt exactly fact.
More Power Levels[]
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/battle-power/list/ - found on Kanzenshuu.Neffyarious (talk) 10:42, September 12, 2013 (UTC)
- Links to more: www.kanzenshuu.com/battle-power/.Neffyarious (talk) 10:48, September 12, 2013 (UTC)
- Fan website aren't reliable sources. But the movie pamphlets are. JeangabinTalkContrib 11:06, September 12, 2013 (UTC)
Out-of-place section[]
Shouldn't the "Influences" section be on Ki or Dragon Ball? Only a few examples have anything to do with power scaling (those should stay here), and some of them just act like Dragon Ball invented the idea of ki, which is ridiculous. Plant (talk) 05:43, October 12, 2020 (UTC)
"Double the power" not entirely accurate[]
The line in the intro that says "In order for someone to be able to take attacks from a foe without taking any damage, they must possess twice the power of their foe", is not exactly accurate. The cited source is from Android 17's Barrier technique in the Special Attack Dictionary of Daizenshuu 7(archived source of Kanzentai translation here).
My translation of the original text: "物理的攻撃はともかく、相手の気功系の攻撃を打ち消すためには、相手の気の倍以上の気を放射し なければならない。(To cancel out an opponent's energy-based attack, one must emit more than twice as much ki as their opponent.)"
The key point is they use the word "ki" here, not "power". The word is 気 (ki) - "ki" (life force, energy), not "力" (chikara) or "パワー" (pawaa). There are guides like the Super Exciting Guide that list "Power/パワー" as a different stat than "ki." The pages referring to this Barrier quote should be updated.
Google Doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/e/2PACX-1vT0lCNbwyTvNYsNnKxuDWDzcjd_LVflOGi6Lz817Qv4j3JRD3yUxwae36FVAcAfjB0abKo9hX3tCqWY/pub Source scan: https://i.imgur.com/wWLmFVm.jpgLogicRock (talk) 10:23, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
Suppressing Power Levels Question.[]
I have seen in the series and read here that one can suppress their own Power Levels on occasions to appear weaker or hide from enemies and such. But does that reduce their actual combat abilities as well?CNBA3 (talk) 14:56, 15 April 2024 (UTC)