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Can we find a better image for this one, its really poor quality.

Antonaidas (talk) 16:04, July 31, 2016 (UTC)

Elder Kai's Counterpart

Would Gowasu be the u10 counterpart to Elder Kai? reasons why i think so.

1. they both look physically old for kais (wrinkles) 2. They are very wise. a lot more wiser then the younger ones and 3. there's 2 that are both surpreme kais in both u7 and 10 0551E80Y (talk) 11:53, August 3, 2016 (UTC)

No, because Universes 7 and 10 are not twin universes. TyphlosionX (talk) 10:18, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

I didn't mention being twin natured. just the u 10 version. 0551E80Y (talk) 11:19, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

They must be twin universes in order to have counterparts of one another. TyphlosionX (talk) 12:30, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Who says? in the end they are all subjects of zeno. so it really doesn't matter.0551E80Y (talk) 19:15, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Just because they have the same jobs does not mean they're counterparts. That's like saying all U.S. Presidents are counterparts. The only way for them to be counterparts is if they are from parallel universes AKA twin universes, which they are not. --TyphlosionX (talk) 19:22, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

all u.s presidents are not counterpart given that they are from same country. they are predeseccors to the next one. we've seen universe 7 and 6 surpreme kais. so that should be noted as the u 6 and 7 counterparts to gowasu. 0551E80Y (talk) 19:29, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Here's a better example that you'll hopefully be able to understand: Monarchs of different countries from the same time period. Yes, they're rulers of land, but they are completely separate lands, thus they are not counterparts. Much like Gowasu watching over Universe 10 and Old Kai watching over Universe 7. Completely separate universes with completely separate overseers.

And you fail to address my point that Universe 7 and Universe 10 are not parallel universes. --TyphlosionX (talk) 20:22, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

They're old and wise, I guess, yeah. But that's like saying Obama and the president of South Africa are "counterparts" because they're both black humans. Not trying to be rude or anything. -- Final ChidoriTalk 20:36, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Thank you, that's exactly my point. --TyphlosionX (talk) 20:37, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

I thought it was already established that different universe counterparts don't exist in Dragon Ball. Beerus and Champa just look similar because they're brothers. Yakon RenderSandubadearPui Pui Render 20:50, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Where was it established?.  also both gowasu and elder kai answer to a higher authority zeno. and the whole parellel universe thing is because they are next to each other. it's got nothing to do with the monarchs. it's all the same in zeno's eyes. gowasu does the exact same thing in u10 that old kai does u7. so that makes them counterparts. 0551E80Y (talk) 20:56, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

So are Dende and the Konatsian Wizard counterparts? Both are gods from different planets. It's all the same in Supreme Kai's eyes. Dende does the same thing on Earth that the Wizard does in Konatts. Yakon RenderSandubadearPui Pui Render 21:11, September 13, 2016 (UTC)
well i suppose. as an encyclopedia is supose to note every little aspect. also that could be brought up on dende's page. but the subject here is gowasu and old kai. 0551E80Y (talk) 21:13, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

0551E80Y, the answer to Sandubear's question was a big fat "No."

Goku is the hero of Earth. That does not make him the conterpart to any other hero of any other planet. Counterparts have to be alternate versions of the same person, as is how this Wiki has handled this in most scenarios (if we considered everyone that are "counterparts" the affiliations section would be too convoluted, which is why we limit ourselves.)

If twin universes were just parellels because they are next to each other, that'd just be dumb. It's obvious from Whis' explanation and the visuals that Universe 6 and 7 mirror each other, just like Universe 10 and Universe 3, Universe 4 and Universe 9, etc. (All universes' numbers that add up to 13 are twins/mirrored (AKA Parellel) )

As of now, the only universe parallels we know are Frost and Frieza. Everyone else is either literal twins (Beerus, Chanmpa, Whis, Vados) or not from a parellel to Universe 7 (Gowasu and Zamasu) --TyphlosionX (talk) 21:52, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Guys, also Remember that Elder Kai is a fusion, meanwhile Gowas isn't. Yon!米津愛主!Golden Frieza artVisit my talk page! 22:31, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Geez it was just a suggestion. goku is the main protagonist but in universe he doesn't have a state of monarchy. this is what i see. gods of creation, 12 of them. each of them do exactly the same thing at  differen't places, they are aware of each other, they visit each other. they do it under the orders of a higher authority. i don't see dende being ordered by the kais to guard the earth. 

I look at gowasu and i see a universe 10 elder kai so he is a counterpart. but if none of you don't want that to be on the article FINE by me, 0551E80Y (talk) 23:03, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

"I look at gowasu and i see a universe 10 elder kai so he is a counterpart."

I'm sorry, but that's not how it works. Gowasu is from Universe 10. Universe 10 does not parallel Universe 7. Thus, Gowasu is not a counterpart to Old Kai.

Whether or not them filling the same roll makes them counterparts is irrelevant, since we don't take those types of counterparts into consideration in the articles. And as seen in my example of Monarchs and Final Chidori's example of Obama compared to the president of South Africa, that doesn't make much sense. --TyphlosionX (talk) 23:37, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

It does work like that with the kais. Obama and Jacob Zuma are different because of different variables in their countries. not to mention their influence are at different levels in the international commitee. while apart from where they are. there is virtually No difference between gowasu and old kai. so therefore it's justified to call them counterparts. No encyclopedia is ever complete. the day it becomes it complete is the day it finishes for good. i think it would be good for the articles to add more. it would give me something to do. 0551E80Y (talk) 00:08, September 14, 2016 (UTC)



No difference? Please tell me that's a joke.

You fail to acknowledge the very universe that he is in is in no relation to Universe 7. You fail to acknowledge the obvious physical and personality differences between the two. You fail to acknowledge that they surely have major historical differences.

Please, explain to me how there is "virtually no difference."

"No encyclopedia is ever complete. the day it becomes it complete is the day it finishes for good." What? Whoever said this wiki is complete? It's quite the opposite at the moment, considering all the new content that needs to be added. Don't really see your point here, it honestly seems unrelated.

"it would give me something to do." If you're so bored, and you have to use wikia to cure your boredom, than how about rather than adding false information to an article, you help out with other things? We could really use someone to spell check (considering alot of editors on this wiki tend to make alot of spelling errors). I honestly don't know what to tell you, other than to not add false info. --TyphlosionX (talk) 01:58, September 14, 2016 (UTC)

It's not false info. it's truth. you fail to notice that everything gowasu has done is the exact same thing as elder kai has done. same playing field just looking at a differen't spot. i see no difference in the two of them so much that they are 2 of the 12 counterparts under zeno's eye.

Speaking of new content the franchise is in fact clay like. nothing ever said in it is set in stone. and toriayama has a history of showing that. so what we say now. odds are in a year time it becomes completely different.

i would love to fill in dende (earth counterpart) but the general census here is it's not going on the article not that i'm wrong. which im not. and you are not gonna change my stance on the subject TyphlosionX 0551E80Y (talk) 02:24, September 14, 2016 (UTC)


I don't think you understand the meaning of identical.

It seems you believe them to be counterparts under Zeno's eyes. But that's just it. That's only Zeno. He just looks at them as servants. That's like saying Turles is Goku's counterpart in the viewer's eyes, meaning we should add that to the article. Which is not the case, becoming 1) that's presumptious and untrue, and 2) if we considered every character being counterparts in that way, the page would be way too crowded and full of affiliates that don't really matter nor count.

Remember, we want this wiki to be easily accessible, not a giant list of people that barely have to do with one another. If someone sees we let Gowasu count, then they'll try to put in others that do not really count nor matter, citing this page as evidence. I'm worried about technicalities.

It seems you're not open to changing your mind, so I'll stop with trying to reason with you.

Now, if you want to put Gowasu down as "fellow Supreme Kai," then I see no problem with that. Old Kai and Supreme Kai seem at least acquainted with the other universe Kais. --TyphlosionX (talk) 10:56, September 14, 2016 (UTC)

Well you could put turles as goku (lookalike saiyan) if you want go right ahead anyone can edit. i rather have too much infomation then not enough. an encyclopedia is suppose to be like that. however i have long been aware that can easily go overboard so people could try and get the entire population of earth their own articles and connect each one to each other that is way too extreme. i would not do that. i thought that the supreme kais which are the highest rank apart from zeno and  their destruction counterparts deserve this annotion as they are forces of nature.  and they deserve this. 0551E80Y (talk) 11:16, September 14, 2016 (UTC)

Wait what?!

Why is Zamas and Future Zamas consirded "villains" but not Gowasu?!BH Ouji (talk) 05:01, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

Because he isn't evil, nor an antagonist.Yon!米津愛主!Golden Frieza artVisit my talk page! 05:59, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

But isn't he supposted to be Goku Black?!BH Ouji (talk) 08:10, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

I hope you're joking. That's just a fan theory  (and a ridiculous one at that). TyphlosionX (talk) 10:16, September 13, 2016 (UTC)

The Death of Gowas

Now, I don't know about the rest of you, but there are many reasons for me to be afraid of the end of the Universal Survival Arc. The biggest obvious one is that while U7 will probably live on, U6 won't, which means bye bye Champa, Hit, Frost, Cabba, female Broly, Botamo, and that lovable lunk of lugnuts Magetta. However, the other thing that has hit me pretty hard, was the confirmation that the kaio/shin of the various universes would also be destroyed. The only Kaioshin besides Elder Kai and the former component of Kibito Kai we have met is Gowas. Personally, I've felt an attachment to Gowas, and enjoyed seeing his reactions and interactions with the various members of the cast and how he attempted to steer Zamas onto the right path. With Goku probably winning the Super Dragon Balls, it seems that given his bromance with Hit he will probably use them to resurrect U6.... leaving U10 and my main man Gowas erased. I really don't want Gowas to die :(

liek if u crai errytim Iamthelegion (talk) 15:00, February 26, 2017 (UTC)

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