Saiyan Saga

Vegeta (Saiyan Saga)

Special Beam Cannon

ITS OVER 9000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehe

I consider this fight the best the series has to offer and challenge anyone to prove me wrong. For clarity's sake, I am mostly talking about Nappa & the Saibamen vs the Z-FIghters but since it's "the Saiyans" I guess that would include Vegeta vs Goku (I usually seperate them and prefer the former over the latter). If that's the case, then there's absolutely no battle that tops it.

Stakes:

There aren't many opponents that get as much build up as the Saiyans. A planet conquering, evil race of aliens all with the same abilities as the already OP protagonist but on steroids is a heck of an introduction. Raditz, a game changer in his own right, showcased just how outclassed everyone was compared to them. The MC, Goku, died in a fight against a Saiyan so there wasn't much hope for the rest of the gang even with Piccolo, Tien and the wild card Gohan. And that's before the fight even begins, once Yamcha gets killed the reality of the situation sets in for the characters and the audience that this won't be a typical fight.

Action:

Throughout the majority of the fight, there isn't much in the way of complex, cinematic martial arts displays and I usually say this as a negative. However, that is exactly why this fight is so great. Up until this point, the characters we've seen have worked for years to get where they are. Piccolo has centuries of experience and alien powers himself but even that wasn't enough against Nappa. This highlights what a masterpiece of storytelling this fight is. I'd love to fanboy over it more but no one wants to read all that. What starts off as a run-of-the-mill battle turns into a fight for survival until Goku gets there. This is probably the most brutal Dragon Ball had gotten to that point as well. Sure, Tao impaled Bora and Piccolo crippled Goku, but character deaths were still rare then. Against the Saiyans, characters were dropping like flies and we weren't even given time to process them as Nappa was still mowing down the team. For those who love the flashy moves, Goku's humiliation of Nappa is cram packed full of them giving everyone a bit of what they love.

Impact:

I can't stress enough just how pivotal this fight (this saga really) is for the series. Several iconic attacks are introduced/popularized here: Destructo Disc, Masenko, Scatter Bullet, Self Destruction, DX Bomber, Kaio-ken. Many memorable characters are introduced with the biggest being Vegeta. This fight also has moments galore: the death of Yamcha, Tien's arm, Chiaotzu and Piccolo's sacrfice. Not to mention the lore dropped throughout the fight: Namek, Saiyan culture, and a completely new level of power. And that's just immediate impact: Frieza, Super Saiyans, Cell and onwards. Everything changes after the Saiyans, and quite frankly, it never really shifts back to the lighthearted tone that there before. If anything, the story gets darker with each new arc, even now it's influence is affecting the manga.

Safe to say that this fight is the greatest in the series as it checks all the boxes and has that rare "Big Fight Feel" that DB is trying to capture now. The textbook definition of a 5 star match.

Raditz

Treating Tree of Might as a canon story for this idea, lets see what you think would happen if Raditz, Nappa and Turles all survived.

(For the record, Vegeta survives as well).

- Firstly, Raditz manages to break free from Goku's full nelson at the last second so only Goku is killed by the Special Beam Cannon, although Raditz is still hit with a glancing blow; As Raditz attempts to get his own back on Piccolo, the Namekian attacks by explosively regrowing his arm to hit Raditz where Gohan headbutted him earlier when Raditz attempts to attack him, which breaks Raditz's cracked armour and stabs him in the chest with his sharp talons.

Following the arrival of Krillin, Bulma and Roshi (along with Gohan having destroyed his pod so he can't flee into space), Raditz's more apprehensive nature kicks in and he flees. Upon revealing what happened to Nappa and Vegeta via his scouter, however, Vegeta chastises him for his failure and warns him that when they arrive on Earth (since they overheard about the Dragon Balls), they'll kill him for being a liability.

- With Kami warning the group about the impending arrival of Vegeta and Nappa in a year's time, Piccolo steals Gohan to train him before they arrive - with Raditz tailing them as his injuries heal to look for an opportunity to steal Gohan in the hope of getting back in Vegeta's good books following his failure to recruit Goku. Although Piccolo does keep Gohan safe for a time, Raditz does find them when Gohan accidentally turns into a Great Ape and Piccolo has to "destroy" the moon - with the trio ultimately deciding to work together to get stronger in case Vegeta and Nappa refuse to spare them.

- As they train together and get stronger, Raditz learns more about Goku from Piccolo and Gohan; reflecting on his actions after hearing how both of them regard Goku positively (despite Piccolo initially wanting to kill Goku himself as his father wanted) and realizing just how much lesser of a Saiyan he is; complete with him having a nightmare of his mother Gine rejecting him for killing his little brother and his father Bardock beating him to a pulp while accusing Raditz of been a cowardly weakling.

Learning that the Dragon Balls can bring people back to life, Raditz resolves to get stronger, become a better person and make amends with his brother. Sure enough, the training yields good success - with all three getting stronger thanks to Raditz's contributions and with all three bonding; Gohan no longer afraid of his uncle as he was initially.

- When the day comes, Raditz joins the heroes against Nappa and Vegeta; the group first battling the Saibamen and with Raditz warning the group about their acid and self-destruct abilities, although Yamcha is still injured (not killed) after one self destructs near him due to getting cocky; no longer able to fight.

Having grown stronger due to the year of training, Raditz is able to put up a good fight with Nappa - who begins to lose his cool at "Raditz the Runt" been able to beat on him, although the others are forced to join in the fight when the Saiyan General regains the upper hand and succeeds in injuring the remaining fighters.

When Nappa throws a Bomber DX at Gohan, Raditz succeeds in grabbing Gohan and getting him out of the way - thus negating the need for Piccolo to sacrifice himself.

- Thankfully, Goku arrives (having been revived by the Dragon Balls beforehand and learned both the Kaio-ken and Spirit Bomb from King Kai) and defeats Nappa by breaking his back before he can kill anyone else - with Raditz apologizing to Goku for what he did and with Gohan and the others confirming that Raditz helped them. When Vegeta tries to kill Nappa as Goku's last attack crippled him, however, Goku stops him - stating that Nappa is no longer a threat and there's no need to kill him; Raditz admittedly wanting Nappa dead after all the years of been belittled by him but deciding to trust his brother's judgement for now.

- Goku's fight with Vegeta then plays out as normal up until Vegeta attempts to become a Great Ape - with Raditz, Piccolo and the rest of the Z-Fighters preventing him from doing so and all working together with Goku against Vegeta; successfully defeating the Saiyan Prince.

Needless to say, Goku lets Vegeta escape - with everyone (including Raditz) more vocal about their disapproval here but with Goku wanting to give Vegeta a second chance after Raditz proved that he could change; the group taking Nappa to the hospital and leaving him with a lot of thoughts to process - especially as his ally for decades was willing to murder him there and then while his enemies spared him and are now helping him, albeit with some reluctance.

- A few days later, Gohan joins Bulma, Krillin, Raditz and Oolong on a picnic but it's disrupted by a forest fire (caused by a probe sent to Earth); Raditz, Krillin and Gohan helping put out the fire and save the animals (including Icarus) but with no Dragon Balls to restore the destroyed half of the forest. The events of Tree of Might then play out the same - with the Tree been planted and the Z-Fighters battling Turles and his Crusher Corps.

- Sadly, Yamcha, Tien and Chiaotzu are killed and Gohan turned into a Great Ape who nearly kills Goku; Raditz been taken down temporarily by Turles and thus forcing Piccolo to save Gohan from Turles' Kill Driver - killing the Namekian. With Goku killing the Crusher Corps and Krillin and Raditz both buying time by fighting Turles (Raditz having consumed one of the fruits to make him more a challenge for the Saiyan Pirate), Goku charges a Spirit Bomb that destroys the Tree and injures Turles.

Despite Raditz's protest, Goku spares Turles but firmly tells him to leave Earth - which he does. With Piccolo dead, Earth's Dragon Balls are inert permanently and Tien and Chiaotzu couldn't be revived anyway. However, Nappa - remembering what Vegeta said - states that there may be more Dragon Balls on Namek that they could use; giving Bulma the remote for his pod and telling her how to use it so that she doesn't accidentally blow the pod up (like she did in the original).

As such, Gohan, Krillin and Bulma take the first Capsule Corporation Ship to Namek while Goku, Raditz and Nappa take a second ship after receiving their Sensu Beans (Raditz and Nappa having some issues to work through); Turles listening in on their communications and learning about the Dragon Balls, to which he also decides to head for Namek as he has no more seeds left and his crew is dead so his situation is rather desperate.

As per the original, Frieza and his forces are already heading for Namek too, with Vegeta recovering before heading to Namek to get the Dragon Balls and gain immortality before Frieza can.

So, with Raditz, Nappa and Turles all alive in this situation, how do you think the story for the Namek Saga and beyond would play out?

Would all of them survive the Namek Saga and turn good, or would we still see a few permanent deaths and notable changes as a result?

Curious to see what you guys think.

For this idea to play out, two major things would change; the first been that Raditz would avoid been killed and turn good, while the second would be that Vegeta would die in the Saiyan Saga without getting resurrected.

So, here we go.

- During the time Raditz is been held in a full nelson by Goku while Piccolo tries to skewer them both with the Special Beam Cannon, he this time is able to break free at the last second; taking only a slight injury to his side while Goku is hit fully and killed.

As Raditz attempts to get his own back on Piccolo, the Namekian attacks by exploisvely regrowing his arm; using it to hit Raditz where Gohan headbutted him earlier, which breaks Raditz's cracked armour and stabs him in the chest with his sharp talons.

- Following the arrival of Krillin, Bulma and Roshi (along with Gohan having destroyed his pod so he can't flee into space), Raditz's more apprehensive nature kicks in and he flees.

Upon revealing what happened to Nappa and Vegeta via his scouter, however, the two chastise him for his failure and warn him that when they arrive on Earth (since they overheard about the Dragon Balls), they'll kill him for being a liability.

- With Kami warning the group about the impending arrival of Vegeta and Nappa in a year's time, Piccolo steals Gohan to train him before they arrive - with Raditz tailing them as his injuries heal to look for an opportunity to steal Gohan in the hope of getting back in Vegeta's good books following his failure to recruit Goku.

Although Piccolo does keep Gohan safe for a time, Raditz does find them when Gohan accidentally turns into a Great Ape and Piccolo has to "destroy" the moon - with the trio ultimately deciding to work together to get stronger in case Vegeta and Nappa refuse to spare them.

- As they train together and get stronger, Raditz learns more about Goku from Piccolo and Gohan; reflecting on his actions after hearing how both of them regard Goku positively (despite Piccolo initially wanting to kill Goku himself as his father wanted) and realizing just how much lesser of a Saiyan he is; complete with him having a nightmare of his mother Gine rejecting him for killing his little brother and his father Bardock beating him to a pulp while accusing Raditz of been a cowardly weakling.

Learning that the Dragon Balls can bring people back to life, Raditz resolves to get stronger, become a better person and make amends with his brother. Sure enough, the training yields good success - with all three getting stronger thanks to Raditz's contributions and with all three bonding; Gohan no longer afraid of his uncle as he was initially.

- When the day comes, Raditz joins the heroes against Nappa and Vegeta; the group first battling the Saibamen and with Raditz warning the group about their acid and self-destruct abilities, although Yamcha is still injured (not killed) after one self destructs near him due to getting cocky; no longer able to fight.

Having grown stronger due to the year of training, Raditz is able to put up a good fight with Nappa - who begins to lose his cool at "Raditz the Runt" been able to beat on him, although the others are forced to join in the fight when the Saiyan General regains the upper hand and succeeds in injuring the remaining fighters.

When Nappa throws a Bomber DX at Gohan, Raditz's attempts to grab Gohan are halted by Nappa grabbing his tail - which Raditz forgot to train - and forcing Piccolo to take a fatal hit, with Raditz angrily tearing off his own tail before he and a furious Gohan both attack Nappa together.

- Thankfully, Goku arrives (having been revived by the Dragon Balls beforehand and learned both the Kaio-ken and Spirit Bomb from King Kai) and defeats Nappa before he can kill anyone else - with Raditz apologizing to Goku for what he did and with Gohan and the others confirming that Raditz helped them, while Vegeta kills Nappa as Goku's last attack crippled his ally; thus making him useless in Vegeta's eyes.

Goku's fight with Vegeta then plays out as normal up until Vegeta becomes a Great Ape - with Goku gathering the energy for the Spirit Bomb but been too injured to throw it after been crushed by Vegeta. This time, Raditz is the one who takes the energy and - after Yajirobe cuts off Vegeta's tail - the other fighters keep Vegeta busy long enough for Raditz to hit Vegeta with the attack.

- Having been caught off-guard, Vegeta is hit fully with the attack and critically injured, with Raditz, Tien, Krillin, Chiaotzu and Gohan all hitting the Saiyan Prince with a final combined energy attack; Vegeta cursing his former ally before dying.

With the battle over, Raditz properly makes amends with Goku - who is willing to forgive Raditz's previous actions as he helped protect Gohan, his friends and the planet - and comfort Gohan over Piccolo's death. However, having learned about Piccolo being a Namekian and with Raditz able to operate the remaining Saiyan pods now that Nappa and Vegeta are dead (so Bulma doesn't accidentally blow them up with the recovered remote), Dr Brief sets about making the Capsule Corporation Spaceships.

- While Bulma, Krillin and Gohan head to Namek in Kami's Spaceship (as they did in the original story), Goku and Raditz later travel to Namek together in a Capsule Corporation Spaceship so they can bond properly as brothers and train together to grow stronger before they arrive.

With Raditz surviving this time instead of Vegeta, how do you think the rest of the timeline would follow throughout DBZ, into Daima (if you choose to consider that canon here) and then into Super?

Would things be much smoother here due to Raditz not having an antagonistic relationship with Goku, or would other factors result in either negative outcomes to be dealt with or an outright derailment of the timeline that ends things prematurely?

Curious to see what you guys think.